In the first of a new series – How-Dozen – Tony Murray interviews leading media and creative folk and throws a dozen questions their way. First into the firing line is Paul Carroll, the founder of Communique PR.
You were one of the region's movers and shakers. How are you spending your time now?
My main activity is Zuma 011, a consultancy I set up to a) advise agencies on how to operate better and b) to help clients develop marketing strategies and work more efficiently with their agencies. I've found I've been able to help both agencies and clients considerably, not least because no-one, especially with my experience, is really at the end of a phone for these people.
But you are not at the forefront in the way you were. I mean you were the governor in N/W PR terms.
Williams
Yes, I was very high profile during my Communique days, but that career phase, if you want to call it that, is over now. Running a business like Communique demanded keeping the consultancy in the limelight, and that's what I did. John Williams, who I love to bits, would always refer to me as a 'media tart'. He was right, but I wasn't doing it to boost my own ego.
Now I don't need to be in the forefront like I was before (except for when you call, Tony, and apart from my regular column in a rival marketing publication).
To my mind you were the consummate professional. I was a big fan. Who is you successor?
Thank God for the industry that there's not 'another Paul Carroll'. Who, these days, is demonstrating the sort of growth, energy, and innovation that characterised Communique's development? Nobody springs to mind to be honest, but somebody will pop up soon - they always do.
Top of the tree right now is Brazen, who certainly have a bit of the old Communique schtick going on. They don't only win accounts you've heard of, clean up on awards and come up with ideas; they're never far from controversy. I've got to warm to that.
Why was Communique so so successful? I really don't wish to kiss your arse (and tougher questions are looming) but you did clean the floor with the competition
Simply, because we wanted to be better than anyone else, and we stuck at it. We constantly assessed what we did, and what worked and what didn't. When we screwed up, which we did all of the time of course, we didn't blame other people and would try and learn a lesson. We kept ego to a minimum indoors (that was for the market) and were hell bent on getting better at what we did, every year.
Once we'd got some success under our belts, that created more confidence to be even more adventurous and innovative, and that was the pattern. On top of that, and this is the crucial element, we understood business and knew how to run one - the marriage of creativity and commerce if you like. That was the combination that created all of the success - most agencies are good at one or the other.
Yeah, but do you miss it?
I've been asked that question many times. The answer is 'no', and I mean it. Firstly, doing what we did at Communique was bloody hard work - it required unbelievable amounts of commitment and energy. It was adrenalin based, but it's not sustainable for an individual, and I'm content not to be in the middle of all that. It's probably like a professional footballer's career - it's finite.
So look on me as Eddie Gray. A consummate performer in his era but knew when to quit playing every week.
The other aspect of not being involved everyday is how you gain perspective. Assisting agencies and clients as a consultant, it's apparent that client-agency relationships are largely configured in hell, partnerships with two abusive partners. Maybe when you're in it day to day, it's the norm, but dipping back in, you wonder how you ever survived it.
What do you regret?
Ah, I've had a few! To be really truthful, I don't regret anything. I've been unwise on occasions, have been known to back the wrong horse from time to time, but you can never live life properly if you're always looking back. Let's face it, when I cocked up, the chances of people being personally harmed or disadvantaged were minimal. I leave 'regrets ' to surgeons and social workers.
You got a lot of shit about Nathalie (Bagnall) and Iain (Leslie)...
Well, we know that people like a gossip, and Communique was always good copy. The thing is, sometimes it's good practice to let people talk a subject to death until they get bored. Changes in the structure of a business are small beer - one day wonders.
I don't discern that there were any 'victims' in my past, quite the opposite as most people who worked at Communique achieved immensely in both personal and financial terms.
As for my personal life, well, I couldn't be happier. I've been interested in the coverage and speculation that Nathalie has been the centre of in the past year or so - it's all good for business, so I keep reminding her.
Beech
I kind of miss you as the central person around town
Well, you shouldn't have buggered off to China then. Taking the lead from your ‘Alternative Wrap’ Spinal Tap reference, what we did, and what the industry does, is rather like showbiz. Everyone lives for 'show time' and parties hard after the gig. The rest - well as Charlie Watts said of the first twenty five years of the Rolling Stones - 'Five years of it was playing; the other twenty years was standing around'.
What is your proudest achievement?
There were a lot of achievements, and critical staging posts along the way, and I think I would have been hard-pressed to have had a better 'job' in any other field. The greatest achievement though has to be selling Communique - not only for the money, but also because by then what we had created was really impressive.
The sale of Communique was achieved because in terms of brand, financial record, status, track record, people, structure, philosophy and sustainability of the business, it ticked all the boxes. That was, undoubtedly, a proud moment.
How do you feel about Communique now?
Not as nostalgic as some people may think. It's obviously fallen from grace and is no longer the force it was - that's undeniable. But the way I look at it is that if I sold a house I'd lavished love and attention on, got a good price and moved on, then it's pointless going back two or three years later to see that the new owners have let it go and that there's an old refrigerator in the garden where my prize petunias used to be. It's a shame, it's a waste, it's displeasing to the eye, but it's not my responsibility any more.
What is your view on Brian Beech these days?
I would wish all of my former colleagues the very best of luck. This is a tough industry, and my target was always to hang up my playing boots at a young age. I did so, so I can only have the utmost of admiration for the endurance of old pros.
Bagnall
Did Nathalie get promoted because of your personal life?
I don't believe anyone actually believes that to be the case. I wouldn't be so stupid to over promote anyone because of personal reasons, and such a suggestion is demeaning towards Nathalie's ability as an MD. The fact is that Nathalie was the best MD Communique ever had, and the consultancy's performance improved 100% when she took over.
Her recent launch of Vertigo, and its impressive growth, led MC2 to acquire the business mainly so that they could get Nathalie to run their overall business. Does that mean Mike Perls is having a personal relationship with Nathalie?
By the way, just to settle this once and for all, I didn't actually appoint Nathalie as MD; Burson-Marsteller did. Bet they wish they'd held on to her.
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